"Jean Charles de Menezes enquiry - latest news" thread in "General Mayhem"
From bbc BBC NEWS | UK | Menezes verdict choice limited The jury at the inquest into the death of Jean Charles de Menezes will ...

From bbc

BBC NEWS | UK | Menezes verdict choice limited

So Cressida Dick is in the clear and there can be no judgement of unlawful killing.

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Because she's already been cleared?

She bore no culpability is what is says.

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I tired of it all TBH and stopped following the story. I struggle to believe plod unloads clips into innocents. Not that it lessens the tragedy of what happened any, but I get fed up with his family being encouraged and presumably paid to come here to criticize our Plod given how their (Brazilian) Plod operates. What happened was bad enough without thsi sort of media circus following it everywhere.

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But they did. Is anybody credible still suggesting they did anything other than that in this case?

Brazilian Police didn't kill their son/brother, complaining to them would be daft.

It has dragged on a bit though, agreed. Everyone involved should just get on with their lives....oh, one of them can't.

I guess not. I mean that they may have got it wrong due to misinformation. Its not a daily occurrence though is it. But yes it is of course tragic and deeply regrettable.


Aye but putting as much effort into their antics would benefit more people. Probably get shot for it though. Where as here they get paid for it.

Aye. I'm not unsympathetic to his death, just the media circus its created.

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I struggle with what we seriously expect to be the outcome. When are we satisfied that 'justice has been done'? For me it's that an investigation has been made and steps are being taken to ensure that it shouldn't happen again - that's it. I'm sure Jean Menezes folks have a different idea and they won't be the only ones

Nice touch, declare her blameless before the inquest, thereby preventing any possibility of an unlawful killing verdict. An open verdict is clearly the only option left, since no sane person could say that shooting an innocent man to death whether due to cockups in the chain of command or a gung-ho attitude by firearms officers constitutes "lawful killing". And even an open verdict is an insult to decency and justice.

I think the killing of an innocent person by the police brought about by the failings of their systems and individual performance is very deserving of a media circus.

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Never break more than one law at a time, and never carry more grass than you are willing to eat.

Not to mention the lies the police told, after, erm, conferring. Every single witness disproves the officers' claims, yet the jury is still told they are not allowed to consider it an unlawful killing. So much for trial by jury...

Non sequitur of the week!


The merits and demerits of the Brazilian police (and yes, I've seen Elite Squad) have precisely fuck-all to do with the facts of the case here in England.


Any way, I don't really see what point you're making.

It's all right for us to criticise "our Plod", but not OK for foreigners to do the same?

Is that true?

There must be a proper reason why the judge has given his direction, though...surely?

He can't just decide the outcome cos he feels like it, can he? He has to have proper justifiable reasoning behind it...

Yep. The coppers claim they identified themselves and shot him as he started to move towards them when they repeatedly told him to stop.

All dozen or so witnesses in the carriage are saying that the coppers never identified themselves and de Menezes was shot sitting down, without any warning to him.

Hmmm, kind of. The program I saw was the De Menezes extended family and villagers baying for Brit Police blood. It kind of smacked of people in glass houses in some ways I suppose. Its not that the incident is beyond critcism obviously, but I didn't think they were right to scream cover up and all the other insinuations agaisnt our whole Police force when they do fuck all to change theirs. Maybe its a misguided defence from me to our Police, I really dont know? But yes I'd probably concede its not really relevant to this specific case but I still dont like it?

The fact that was a Brit program there sensationalising it such a way, was just so, dare I say it, Daily Mail. I guess the fact that programs like that are made for Brits says more about us than the Brazilians though. Maybe its that I really find so unpalatable?


See thats what I find difficult to believe. Witnesses are notoriously unreliable anyway, but add a noisy tube environment and multiple movements and screams and shouts I doubt the reliability of their testaments. Its not like they sat there slowly watching the events unfold before them. The Police were under the impression this was a man about to detonate a bomb. I think the actions would have been determined, rapid and accurate. By the time everyone was even thinking WTF it would have been boom boom boom and game over.

The whole thing has become such a double edged sword. Whilst the death of an innocent is clearly wrong, what if the next time the guy is a bomber and they dont react. Multiple deaths of innocents because they didn't react will equally have people screaming for heads to roll. Damned if they do damned if they dont. The whole thing is a mess with no possible good outcome.

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Wasn't he in the UK illegally?

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Problem child

What has the behavior of the Brazilian police got to do with our police doing a monumental fuckup?

I don't see why them screwing up excuses ours?

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"Its easier to make a fast bike reliable than a reliable bike fast" Soichiro Honda.